Transcript
Okay, we're back. I'm ready. I don't really have a lot of enthusiasm. They live from the Hyderabad. Public school. A private high school in India which features these notable alums ready, Microsoft CEO, Satya Nadella Adobe CEO, shantanu Narayan, former MasterCard, CEO Ajay banga, Fairfax, Financial CEO Prem Watsa and Procter & Gamble. CEO designate, Shailesh jejurikar, that's incredible, high school, you know. Deborah Messing went to my high school. She was, she was on, she was on a boring fun, sitcom. It's an all new. Terrific Tuesday edition of business fans, featuring animals home at mascardi. On today's lead independent turkey called November 25th. 2025 the who do you blame game? Yeah, that's got. Its got to be our best show, right? It's our most exhausting show both with the amount of details and the effort put into it. I mean, it's I mean listener, too. Probably it's objectively. The best thing that we do. Where we are objectionable but this is actually good. Well, maybe wait till you hear the actual stories. All right, good. The understanding how the Hooda you blame game works? Do you want to explain it? Do I need to explain it? You understand it? I I think I do. You say a headline and then yeah, we pick a headline and just so everyone knows. This is how incredible we are as an organization. Yeah, I'm gonna tutor on horn for once. We don't like are all the headlines we pick are like yesterday this morning the day. Like you know, we don't have like everybody cast Mill where we're like, you know, we're looking at a story like two months ago, we're digging around. Like we're, we're active. We're at it. We're in the headlines. Not to mention that our staff who works Around the Clock. God loves them is 0 people. So, oh God, hate them. Here we go. Is this Show sponsored by anybody today? Oh yeah, our show today is being sponsored by free flow to analytics. Yeah, if you flow analysts.com, the only platform measuring board power connections performance for free. I just, yeah, go ahead. Just had a conversation this morning with some people who are all I want to do now is vote no campaigns, because the new SEC thing. Hey, we finally the final Whittle down to what we think is the most important which is directors. Hello, and now everyone's like, where do we, how do we do that? And it's like, oh, free flow analytics has data and listen to our shows. I mean, we'll give you ideas constantly about how to use the data, how to interpret the data. And again, it's not it's not politically to the left or right. It doesn't have a political message behind it. It's just maybe we do sometimes, but the data doesn't did you. Did I tell you that free flow? Analytics gave me all their data. Yeah, and I built on top of it. A predictor of which directors going to get voted out next. I like this does account for for the anti the things I'm gonna do next are scenario models. Like, like the anti woke movement is involved earnings Jobson jobs. No Felts is racist. Yeah I mean I got it I don't have any stories about activist investors in my list today but it is forever remarkable to me that an activist investor sneezes right. And suddenly glass Lewis ISS, whoever Vanguard suddenly like they're paying attention they're voting they're they're having they have serious comments about directors and chairs and where for 7.6 yeah is where we're on. So you should have already been planning a vote against before they showed up, right. I mean if The bar is low. Pretend you're an activist all the time. That's all you have to do. If you're right, that's it, right? That's your job proxy advisors and investors. That's your job investors investors. All right, let's do this thing. So you're gonna do a couple. I'll do one. Yeah, I don't have that many. You had a busier morning. You were talking to people. I was working on this dumb show. Here's the headline. A Campbell's Campbell's. Is it kills, is it still called Campbell's Soup company? They got rid of soup I think Campbell's Foods. I think. Yeah, it's something like that. Yeah, and division, we made fun of their division names. They didn't they named it? The division, like, tasty food and for that might have been crafted. I might have been crafted. So the headline is Campbell's places VP on leave following viral, poor people rant there. I mean, hey, it's impressive that they've already done something. They've already put them on leaves. So this is coming from a lawsuit. The former Campbell's security analyst, Robert Garza has followed a lawsuit against Martin Bailey. He he still is, I guess he's on leave, but he's the company's vice president and Chief Information Security Officer. This seems important, he was quoted as saying we have shit. For. Fucking poor people. He's referring to the products. Campbell's, we have shit. I'm interpreting this because it's been censored. So I'm I'm guessing what the swears are. He's saying, we have shit for fucking poor. People who buys our shitt. I don't buy Campbell's products barely anymore. I'd like to know what he does by though. That suggests that good stuff, right? Yeah. Let's get something delicious. It's easy eating bioengineered me. I don't want to eat a piece of chicken that comes from a 3D printer. Now I'm interested in this if they're 3D printing meat. I think that'd be kind of a cool thing to tell people what they're trying that. I I would not eat it and then he went on to make derogatory comments about Indian co-workers, referring this thing. Fucking Indians, don't know a fucking thing and they couldn't think for them. So he's just an assholes. So I, I have not been closely monitoring this story. I saw that it's just dropped. Just dropped. Where did it happen? Was this in the bathroom revealed in the lawsuit? Oh, it Was it a supposedly? This is what makes it kind of crazy. Is that the lawsuit says that this comes from a from a tirade while Robert Garza was, I guess he's just having a meeting to try to get a raise. He was trying to get a promotion or something with his with his boss, who was just, it's a weird story, but Campbell's has already responded saying that they're proud of the food we make in the high ingredients. And that, you know, the comments are absurd. And then they went on to say and this this kind of goes into my game a little bit, dude, would you blame game? They said, keep in mind the alleged comments are made by an IT person. Who has nothing to do with how we make our food. All right, just keep that in mind, that quote, that's enough official statement from the Campbell's food company relating to the story because this is a, this is a bad PR story especially, like right before the holiday season. This is like kind of the worst story you gonna deal with right and this type. Okay, does know how to open the can of soup, right? Like he does know that part, okay? You just check GPT to do that. All right, so who do you blame? I joked to you yesterday, that When I read the headline, shouldn't this have been Tyson Foods. They're talking about. This sounds like, this sounds like a story that comes from a family held firm and then, of course you immediately. Retorted. Well, this is a family health. This is, they are, if they are Tyson, right? So say, I forgot so gambles. Do you blame the founding families and that includes modern day. So it's Mary Alice Malone. Okay, Mary Alice Dorrance Malone. She just passed away her daughters taking over her role in the board. Matt, this is the first woman. I think I've joked about this for a while but this is the first woman I've ever seen. Use the word the name Junior in her name, so I kind of loved her for this. I like Mary Alice. Dorrance Malone Jr. Have you ever seen that before? Never seen. Not I love not, yeah, but she's one of the controlling family members along with Bennett Dorrance and Archibald Van Buren combined, they control 35% of the voting power, but more importantly, according to freefall analytics, they control 76% of board influence. The port. The point being that this family is in control of this company. So you could, you could blame the controlling family for creating an atmosphere that hires dudes like that. I guess that's just that's the first possible. Perfect thing to blame. Okay. I yeah, it's gonna be hard to top that as the the person to blame here. How about Investors a week ago? They held their annual meeting average. Director support was 98%. Nine directors were over 99% which is just incredible for a company. That's really not doing that. Great. I didn't like, 52% of the shares owned by. The family isn't like 35, they have 35% voting power. At least those top three. I just mentioned, but I have, I've looked at the, I took a while looking at their recent performance or share price, the companies kind of been declining steadily over the years. It's not, you know, it turns out, soup can't compete with like Brock. Is that what you're saying? Also like let's be fair, I don't necessarily agree with everything that guy said but the Campbell's soup is really not known for being too healthy. It's known for being full of sodium and, you know, some calories and fat and it's it's not known as being super healthy. Let's just, I think it's like 87. It's like a salt lick. I think it's 87% sodium, which is what's odd to me? Is this is that 43% sure? There's said, yes, to a simple majority vote. But but then only 11% said, yes to a regenerative agriculture program, including pesticide reduction outcomes, so they could have they had a chance to vote on food stuff, but they right away that investors that's a second one. You blame investors, the third and this this is going back to my quote that they said that he was an IT person know nothing about the food. Listen to all the non-family board members, there's nine non-family board members, I'm not going to read all their names but some of their names include Fabiola Arredondo, Howard Avril, former basketball player Grant. Hill. Oh, Grant Hill. South the board, you know about food? Exactly that's my point here and I'm gonna tell you all their areas of expertise. I won't give you all the names about their areas of expertise family investment trusts former Time Warner CFO. A former CFO of allergen, which is a pharmaceutical company up a basketball player, e-commerce, sales global Shipping the chair. He's an appliances and the closest one is a man named Kurt Schmidt, who was a CEO of a weed company. A cannabis company and used to work at a company that sold pet food. That's it, that's the expertise on your board. No food. Just like the IT guy, no food nothing but but no weed and Pet Food. The weed guy definitely knows food because and the pet food is The Leftovers of the food. So I'm gonna say he's adjacent at least, how about the family members. Once in wealth management, one has a degree in art history from Princeton. And the newest one, the woman Mary Ellis Ernst Malone, Jr. She's an accomplished. A question in a luxury fashion entrepreneur. So there's no food here at all. And all right, that's the third choice, the board. The fourth choice is the CEO Mick. Be quiet in. Again no food background 13 years with Goldman Sachs and roles including managing director. In the merchant banking division. Actually, I have. Yeah, go ahead and the merchant banking division. Yeah, I have I'm a, if you knew that the CEO of your food company, Was just a banker. Shouldn't you never buy that food or I mean or just a vote against the directors of the meeting but or both know but that that that would be like you know like if the head of your medical you know specialized medical device company is like marketing expert or something like a travel agent. Yeah they have nothing. I agree with one another, I agree. Finally, do you blame American pop artist Andy Warhol for somehow making Campbell's company eternally relevant, like, without him. I wonder if this company would still exist. Honestly, that's really, I really do Wonder this, I have to say when you said that, one of the family members is what, like an art dealer. What would you say they were like, well, he well, he has a Bennett. Dorrance, has a bachelor's degree in art history from Princeton and you get green sustainable leadership from Arizona State. But the the art history when you get because your family is like one of the most famous pieces of pop art. Isn't that? Look, I just go get that. I took several art history classes actually loved my art history classes, but I think it, you get a degree in our history. When you're Bennett during it's because you don't even really know how you ended up to Princeton in the first place. It's probably because of your family and you're probably not like smart enough to kind of handle philosophy or something that and been, if I'm wrong, I know Ben. Alice is the show if I'm wrong. Reach out that harsh best you get on here and Wrangle with hazelnut. All right, so my options here are yeah, the founding families. Yes, investors the boards that the the not not a foodie food except for one guy did pet food a little while ago, the CEO, no food Andy Warhol. Yeah, who is dead? He's dead. Can I ask how long is the CEO been there? Am I allowed follow-up questions here? You might like, you keep wondering things and I'm gonna slightly type this into my well because computer like the CEO, if this guy is, you know, he's the he's the Chief Information Security Officer number one. Not sure what information security Campbell's have, like them only been CEO since February. So I can't blame the CEO although all future food related problems. I will absolutely blame the CEO. Okay? Because that guy is a banker running like like effectively a chicken gristle Mill. Is he his formerly? He joined the company as CFO and 2019 so that was the trajectory there. All of it makes me uncomfortable. I, I could go for the board except that the board is basically, whoever the Campbell's pick. Yeah, Grant Hill in basketball player. I don't get that one. I don't even think investors care because they realize, they did their vote doesn't matter. And that's so it's down to me between Andy Warhol and the founding family, okay? Like, and the reason why it's down to Andy Warhol, in the founding families, is because I to your point, I know you're saying it as a joke. No. But does anyone care about Campbell's if not, for actually Warhol? Yeah, I'm actually not singing as a joke, I think I, I really actually believe that. Yeah, no, actually, I actually agree with you. I'm not sure anyone eats it, it's not for him, right? But I'm going to go with the founding family. It's Blame Andy Warhol, for that most almost. It was good. I'll do one more. I'm gonna write down finding families, Campbell's Next one's a bit quicker. And sadder. Ah, there was a from the. Where is this? Where did I find this from the Harvard Law School Forum on corporate governance? Yeah, we're so with it, that we even checked, like blogs at Harvard at our blogs. Although, luckily I'm forget. Okay, I'm not gonna tell Larry Summers, joke, I'm gonna move on, no, move on. So this is a report. It was a blog entry about the Q3 2025 gender, diversity index from equilar. I just wanted to highlight some of the things going on, with women on boards. There's little movement on boardroom generator diversity, is that number is basically State at 30% for over a year. There's no movement. But more importantly, new, female director appointments have hit a record low down to 22% of new directors. On Russell, 3000 boards, the lowest percentage recorded in the entire study going back to 2017. It wasn't that long ago that this number was above 40%, but Now, it's it, keeps crashing down lowest ever recorded on this study and all. So they're reporting that 6% of boards are composed of at least 50% women, which which is kind of shocking. I mean, that means that 95.94% Of the boards have over 50% men. I mean, obviously, I'm not that I don't understand that, right? You men, yeah, that's a pretty damning statistic, but this is a so who do you blame for this? Oh, and really, I'm focusing on the the harshest number here. Is this record low? 22% of new directors are women? This is crazy and we've actually been finding evidence of this. Of course, in a case we've been reporting this in one of our other shows. That where are the women? Where the, where the women? Yeah, they're down to two, they're retiring, they're not coming back. They're not replacing them does. Yeah, down to two women on the board. Who do you blame? Do you blame the anti d e. I Maga movement. That seems like maybe a easy political choice, right? It's okay to hate women again. Sure. Okay. Do you blame by that though? Do you blame nominating commits on board specifically their chairs. You could blame them. Yeah. Now we're getting closer. Do you blame passive investors? And by that I'm really looking at the black rocks, the Vanguard to really they began. They put their, they put their like pinky toe into this conversation, that they remember Goldman Sachs, right? They They had requirements. BlackRock had requirements. They started in on this conversation like five years ago. Yeah, go Goldman Sachs. Had had a Target that they would not like fund a company and IPO a company, unless it had a certain percentage women on the board and then they declared at the beginning of the anti-wolf Magnum movement, as shifting, they declared that they've accomplished it. And they know, right, that goal. Right? Well again, so that, you know that suggests part of the anti-diagonal Jones, you know, the because they Could very easily. I don't know what they could be doing on us. I think it's funny that prior to the Maga movement. Eagan Jones didn't make a single headline and now we're we talked about mentioning them in the Jones Brothers. They get mentioned the Eagan. Jones gets mentioned, or finally, do you blame all the previous female board members, who retired, or died? Because if because if they hadn't step down or if they were mortal, maybe these numbers would be better, right? That's the Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Okay. That's that corollary, right? Like one of the worst moments in American history that because timing of her death down, she didn't America Obama was President and and then like get replaced she died when Trump was president. And now the Supreme Court is fully captured by the mango movement okay who do you blame for this one? I'm not blaming the Magnum movement. Like look, I think the it's a little overstated to say the this is like latent, right? Like it's not exactly like corporate boards. Were bastions of diversity, 30% is what we've had four years. And it got up to that right? You know what? Yeah, you're right. And and you know what's interesting is that that was kind of the original. The original Target in America was this like mythical 30%, just like over in Europe, the mandated targets were 40% right for some countries like, like Norway's. We Denmark. Yeah. But and both the US and in Europe, they hit the Target and they stopped. Yeah, they stopped. That's it. It's, they were like that. Okay, we're done. That's exactly how it works. It's not the meritocracy isn't about Merit. It's about like affirmative action. Isn't like it's about the pitchforks. The pitchforks mob. That's what the reason why it exists is because with your 70% of the control is in like, dudes hands and unless you set a number threshold. No one cares like no, you know, does it according to the data, free flow analytics. Anyway, that 30% of Of women on the boards. They don't even control that much influence on the boards. Like, I would say, the only thing that's changed here, the anti Dei movement is always been there, it's just been quiet. The passive investors have always just voted in every director, the proxy experts. They they don't do it. They do whatever management says, they don't ever like go out on a limb themselves. You can't really blame the board members themselves for dying. Oh, maybe they should, maybe they need to stop. The only one to blame here is nominating committees. And in fact, you know the I mentioned at the top like a predictor of directors, getting voted out all of my early predictions say that there's only two factors that matter. About getting voted out high-risk director, there's only two factors. Number one and most overall I is attendance. We make jokes about that on proxy countdown or other show. If you don't show up to 75% of the meetings, that is when you get voted out. Yes. Period somehow. It's the one thing that's stuck. It's the one objective criteria stuck. The only thing that investors will guarantee that they don't like you being on the board is, you didn't show up. That's it. That is their Benchmark, right? Like, which is it would be like you could graduate college with an, A plus plus, like a 98%, right? If you just go, that's it. That's all investors. Say number two is be the chair of the nominating committee. Really? Yeah. For the past couple years. The chair of the nominating committee, their job was make sure that there's at least 30% women on the board and they'd get Negative votes. When they were because the policies of the passive investors were, we need some base level of, you know, gender equality on these boards. So, being the chair of the nominating committee at a company that doesn't have 30% women, guarantees you a vote against for at least some of those investors. Now that this is God. I think it's just going to be attendance. Now like I think it's nominating committee chairs now like they're the ones. Who are? They're the ones who are changing, they change the rule, they said investors, their policies are no longer matter and no one's going to challenge us. Let's just bring in dudes. They were never bring it shows that they were never bringing in women because they were looking for women to put on boards. Who are they? Look now, we're looking for the most qualified people. They're just bringing in their people, their people were all men. It's the nominating committees get rid of you blame. All right, that's why blame give me blame. Come on. All right, I have a longish one. Yeah. I saw this headline Watchdog group warns AI teddy bear, discusses sexually explicit content, dangerous activities. Okay. There's just teddy bear and I did not make up the name of this teddy bear. The company that makes it his full oi and the teddy bears called the cummer bear. Is that sure? That's how you pronounce it? It could be Kuma bear cave. Let's just hope it's 99 dollars. Yeah, apparently and it used chat GPT and a little device inside it and you could give it to your kid and the kid could have a conversation with the Talking Teddy Bear, okay. Only a man could have dreamed up a company like this, it's unbelievable. So open AI. Actually what happened is the AI teddy bears. When given to a researcher, the researcher started, probing it with questions and it started telling the researcher how to light matches where the knives were stored usually and sexually explicit Kinks right? Like that. That's better than matches the game. Open. AI has said they are suspending full of toy for violating it the terms of service. But who do you play me here? Go ahead. Who do you blame? The easy one is fully the founder and CEO Larry Wong. He's actually trying to use Larry. He's not his real name. He calls himself on LinkedIn Chief geek officer. He has a background in child, psychology and Behavioral Science. Except he doesn't, he has a background and computer science waiting. Again. He said, Know you'd think he had a value psychology making toys. I was hoping. Yes, he has a background in computer. Science was a founder of a tech Telecom company. He was a software engineer. Why not tell you how many times this this is happening now all over there. They don't come true. It's the same joke about, you know, if a bank if a merchant banking expert from Goldman Sachs is selling soup. Do you trust the soup? Why the hell would I trust anyone selling products to Children? If they come from, what did you say Telecom? What do you started a telecom company? And he once worked as a software engineer for an insurance company. I would love to regulate who are the CEOs and board members at companies that try to sell shit to our children. How about we regulate that? Like I feel like this should be Bare minimum requirement that the person who sells you, the thing took at least a two-week class in the thing or something, right. Mark, Zuckerberg would have to step down that's not like we need something, but he did. He was qualified enough to write this on the website about the comma bear. Okay? Quote comma are adorable, bear combines Advanced, artificial intelligence with friendly interactive features, making it the perfect friend for both kids and adults from Lively conversations to educational storytelling. Full of toy adapts to your personality needs, bringing warped fun and a little extra curiosity to your day. I guess to curiosity covers. How do I light a match where the knives I can kill somebody. And what's your favorite sexual position? That would be curious, right? Yeah. Well, so now what covered now, what do I give my child? I give him like a laptop to cuddle with. I put some like fur on a laptop. What did you give him a gerbil you could so full of choice. Number one, number two, well, no volatile or the CEO, or and the CEO. I mean, they're one thing. It's one guy, right? Like it's like, it's a couple people that work there, but they basically, it's in China. They, it's getting a stuffed like a bear. Stuffy is like one cent in China shoving a little device in it. That talks to the internet is this another scent. Like you don't need a lot of people to do this. The other option. Open AI itself. A story about open are later. So, yeah, go ahead. I mean, the same almonds commitment to do everything for the benefit of humanity. Stopped just short. I have sex advice from baby toys. I have the same, we're covering the same thread here. Yeah. Yes, go ahead. He said though, since he had kids of his own, yeah, it would help him. Not destroy Humanity, they would ground him. I don't really get the logic there. How does that help? Do you think that he's that? Do you think this Sammy Junior should get a come a bear for? I think I feel like at a minimum product that uses Chachi PT should be sent to Sam Altman's. Kid is he said just something that parents. Don't commit crimes against humanity. It's like never happened. This is never suggestion there. Well. Oh, I mean they don't have access to all of humanity. Not like Mark and Sam do so but what do you say though? Because I have kids now? Yeah, well I won't help. I won't Story Humanity. Yeah, that's something yeah, why is he building a? Why does he have a billionaire bunker? Why build that like, why what's I just what I want is for every CEO who makes a product that they're like here for hydraulic child? I think they have to give it to their kid. I think that that's the way, because if you're afraid that your kids gonna die using it or like commit suicide, maybe don't make that product. Yeah. Well, the kids, too, busy like sitting in his Lamborghini probably. Okay. I got you open number three and yeah open AIS board. Oh I did the same thing. Go ahead. I mean this is easy. Obviously if they had fired Sam Altman, they did. They did. But if they had stuck with it, oh, it's stuck with it right there wouldn't be sex Bears using chat GPT, right? Well, I don't know that. You can't really, that's not logic. That's gonna hold up in court. I'll just say, Helen could be, they're still could be who Alan owner, who what like it was funny when I, when I, when I was like, searching for the date, that Helen toner was kicked off the board. Yeah. Google's AI said, hell and owner was not fired from the board. She resigned, like I said that may be right. Like, come on telly like great, right? That's the narrative. We're going with she since said quote, but for years, Sam had made it really difficult for the board to actually do that job by withholding information, misrepresenting things that were happening at the company and in some cases outright lying to the board and said that, all, men gave them inaccurate information about the small number of formal safety processes. The company did have in place Helen toner Was looking for the safety. Protocols Altman was hiding them. And if the board had listened to toner, Maybe. Um, Altman. Wouldn't be able to say the teddy bear, like you misheard it, it didn't say, it loved oral sex. You just misheard it. Which is basically what he says. That was the whole point, right? Sam was was busy trying to Have the company. Make a lot of money and and world domination in Helen was like, no it's not really the charter of this company. It's not really wasn't supposed to be doing that somewhere else. Yeah. Which brings us to our last. Who do you blame? Do you blame Microsoft? Oh that's this is awkward. Why Microsoft? so, despite misgivings from Bill Gates through 10 billion dollars at open AI in January of 2023, And November of 2023. The boardroom move Samuel Altman. Microsoft, it came out there was a Wall Street Journal article this year about this. It turns out Microsoft had released a version of chat GPT, to, in India that Altman, sanctioned that did that avoided the safety, protocols, they, they did it outside of safety course the board was supposed to sign off on the release, but did not see it. Well Altman lied to them and hit it, you know, crazy that was in 2023. That was the precipitating thing that toner and and members of the board said you're lying and you're going around safety, protocols, you're fired makes me nuts. But rather than Microsoft pulling back, the release they had made a 10 billion dollar investment in open AI. They actually do you remember this? They hired Sam Altman. Three days after he was fired, do you remember? Yeah, they were going to start a new version of open I at Microsoft and like hire everybody, right? Yes. Started everybody at opening under the umbrella and that's what precipitated the basically, everybody's to be like the employees to revolt and everybody revolted and they got rid of toner instead brought Altman back. Microsoft might be singularly responsible in protecting their short-term 10 billion dollar investment for being the first Cog in the sex Bear Wheel. Wow, I I appreciate the sleuthing here but I'm I'm going right for Sam alderman. Oh, it's a blame Microsoft for Sam Altman's doing. That's just it's a step too far. Same moment would not exist if not for Microsoft now. Well, that's even fired. That's true, right? Like there might be still sex bear AI talking whatever's, but then then, can we blame them? Would be fired. Can we blame the Hyderabad Public School in India? Because that's where that's where, you know, Della went to high school. I'm just saying when we look at open AI, we might be looking at it wrong. There would be no Sam Altman and someone else, charged whatever. I appreciate, where you're going, someone else they would have gotten that investment from someone else. So but me maybe, but all, I know is that Altman released Chachi BT without any guardianship, so I can think that's all. I can think Altman was fired. Yeah, and the people that saved Altman were actually Microsoft. Okay. All right. So you're wrong but it's fine. It's your like, is your game. All right? You got two more. That's the beauty of this game. Is that technically I very could have easily entered follow toy, CEO, Larry Wong and felt good about it. I I really I could have or Microsoft any one of them. This is why this is America's fastest rising ESG, corporate governance game. And the only one actually, because, because the secret to this game is all the answers are correct. They're all, they all can be correct. Depends on depends on the clock. Kaleidoscope, you're using and, and which way you're facing the Sun, and there's a lot of variables, but, and here's proof because I'll do, I'll do one for you and you'll notice that all the answers could be correct or wrong. And let's stick with open AI. Open AI. This is from CNBC opening AI announces. This is exciting, right? That when because they're not announcing something important probably because they announced lots of things. I mean, based on everything you just said, except Larry Summers resignation, they didn't bounce that they didn't, that's true. Based on everything you just said, this is an important company doing important things and they're not the employees aren't even let the CEO. Get fired, open AI, announces shopping, research tool, In latest e-commerce push. so, Does that. What does it do? It it generates details, in-depth, shopping guides, It Compares products. That's the that's what we're using artificial intelligence for. Yeah. And let's not forget the reporting that you just did on it. I pulled a quote saying that same with these new abilities, we can have shared prosperity to a degree that seems unimaginable today in the future. Everyone's lives can be better than anyone's life. Is now a few weeks. They've targeted, they've partnered with Target with Walmart. They're doing e-commerce shopping to. I mean it's a joke is a joke, it's not absolute joke. Who do you really don't understand why I like making my purchase of tube socks frictionless is, is my goal. And how do we get this far from the from the what happened to the original Mission? The this was like controlled by another Humanity but if you really what are you doing? Okay, I looked at this from a different perspective, my client is go up. Had different categories, this similar to yours. But who do you blame? Do you blame the sick of fans? Those are the ones you already mentioned the basis of the entire company who who refused to let the board fire Altman, right? um, in fact they they said in their open letter that they're unable to work for they're talking about the board unable to work for or with people that lack competence judgment and care for our mission and employees. They demanded that all the current board members resign and we we don't joke about this part enough. Their idea too was to a point to new lead independent directors. Too. Right two and they are they misunderstanding like what it means to be a lead independent director and itself, like two of them, I would like cos and co-lead in dependent directors. So basically they're admitting we're being run by a dictator who refuses to follow the mission, but we like him and to show you the where did this to show you that this is in the open letter? This is the employees signed this open letter. It's, and they were saying to show you that will figure out how to create checks. And balances, although not the ones that you just suggested. We're going to fire you. We're gonna have two new lead independent directors to watch over Sam. I mean, which this whole thing is absurd that I bet. Okay, that's your first choice to sycophants. Let me keep going because I have a lot to say, okay? Yeah. Do you blame the the new initial board? So this is the new board they created after the old board, which included Larry Epstein Summers, who we just talked about a guy from Salesforce named Brett Taylor, he's the chair of a new board or how about this Despite the fact, the employees wanted to fire the whole board. They kept Adam D'Angelo, the CEO of Korah who voted against Sam Altman, but they kept him, they kept the dude, remember this part. Yeah, but they fired the women. I think, he, I didn't, he say the women tricked me with their the siren the tricked him. So do you blame the new initial board, which feature Larry Summers and a bunch of dudes? Do you have blame the next new board? Member's, which is I don't really know how they're on the openai board. That's Sue Desmond Helmand. She was the former CEO at the bill and Linda Gates Foundation, another Epstein connection there. I mean, people don't really talk about Bill Gates, but he's also connected to the Epstein. Files, right. Yeah everywhere. Nicole. Iran-Contra Seligman. She was one of the lawyers who defended Ollie North. Right Ollie North with the Reagan Administration was illegally set like selling arms to Iran. Remember to raise money to fight an illegal War, Latin America. And I think a Nicaragua remember all that. Yeah, or Fiji SEMO. She's a CEO of instacart. We should have known with that appointee. They hired the CEO for the board. Who runs another dumb e-commerce company. We should know. So, do you blame that new board? Call her, right? I I got too many things to say here. Do you blame the waffles? Remember the waffles were Adam, D'Angelo who voted first voted him out and then came back. Remember Ilya sutzkever. He he first voted to fire Sam Altman, but then he started crying and changed his mind. Yeah, that, no, I take it back. Yeah, he was very careful. Yeah, yeah. So we could blame the wafflers. Or I have a Twist in this one. Do you not blame Helen toner and Tasha McCauley? They're the two women that got? Yeah, I can vote to not blame some people or finally. Did you just blame Sam Altman? This is a lot going on here. I'm sorry. Do you play Ah, who do you blame so e-commerce? You know, you know an AI. You made a prediction. For years ago, on one of our shows, maybe I should just stop right now that Fiji SEMO would be be the next CEO of Facebook. You made that prediction, why? And it's not wrong yet. The only reason why I know that person's name. It's not wrong yet. Um because wow, isn't it? What this is all about? I mean Fiji SEMO does represent something important here but all these companies that we talk about in this save the world that just selling shit to you in the new board members because Fiji seem Oh that's oh I'm gonna blame all right. Yeah like when you put together a board boards get put together, usually for about for Three core reasons, right? Number one is regulatory, they they need like an audit person or, you know, some from Young always gets on there. They need someone for the accounting committees. What? So there's like some regulatory. Demand number two is, you want your friends on the board, right? Like people, you've done business with people, you know, people, you call her and number three is, you want access to markets that you want to sell it, right? Like you either want your suppliers, if you are, you know, you're selling something and there's suppliers you want to know the supply chain if you Bringing on the CEO of instacart. Actually could be specifically to understand or get access to sales channels instacart works with Walmart Target. All the, all the big ones. Yeah. So if you wanted to know, like, how am I, we're gonna partner. Isn't that the perfect person to kind of have? Yeah. Your disposal on the board. Nothing would care about his board, I'm not sure he listens to them anyway, but I just support the rest of the board makes no sense. It's like, we went from having actual oversight to the employees to pretending like they wanted to new lead, independent directors. I have just a bunch of cronies. One of whom is Larry's Auto sense. That makes a lot of sense. Oh, Summer's because he's famously connected to Zuckerberg, right? Like so like or Brett Taylor because he's famously connected to musk and the Twitter and like, sales for Benny off, like it's just Tech, bro. Adam D'Angelo is no Tech, bro. I think Altman's friend. I mean, I, yes, straight up again right on the original board. He did the original board telling lie, though, he did vote to, this is how bad what Sam Altman was doing. Was this is a Is that co-founder ilyasova and Buddy Boy, Adam D'Angelo along, with the two women they voted to remove him. It wasn't just the women who were actually in the face of a man DeAngelo, like, was the one of the first CTO of Facebook. So, Facebook connection might have been talking to Mark and being like, I don't know what to do here and Mark was, like, you gotta get rid of him like, so maybe you just got influence. I don't know. But, Sue Desmond. Hellman, was on the board of Facebook all so gives the appearance of right for the benefit of humanity, right? He's Foundation. Yeah, they like selling she was she was at Sony though she right? Oh no, that was cool. So that was selling men's selling men. You need a lawyer on the board. You always need a lawyer but you don't want a lawyer's gonna tell you what not to do. You get the contrarian the flip lawyer, you get the lawyer who backed Ali North, right North, but working for a company like Only in Sony pictures. I mean, that's a that, that's a lawyer who knows, like fighting. She knows, I think these might be incredibly strategic appointments. So, the new problem saying, yes. So yeah, I actually might agree with you on this one because the first initial board members were his buddies and like a kind of a mentor, Like Larry Summers was the mentor a couple of tech Bros. It was that next cohort that really shaped the future of open AI, right? Feet. SEMO. Being really the like, I mean, this company was headed. I'm not gonna blame her specifically like, this is this oh, women too directional women. Yeah, one more. And then I'll hand it off to you. Another bit of a meaty one here, Kohl's. Okay. I'm going to have to bring you up to speed on coals. So the headline is Kohl's names. Michael Bender, as permanent CEO. After turbulent year and sales declined, okay? How much you remember about Cole's? We had a lot of retail craziness, retail, CEO crazy. Was it them or Kroger? Because it's happened at the same time. Yeah, that didn't announce, why the CEO. Okay, so Kroger still don't know why. Yeah, okay is must be incredible. Creep, we still don't know. A Kohl's was just as crazy. And I'm gonna try to paraphrase this quickly. As she Buchanan became CEO in January they gave him like 20 million dollar gold in. Hello, they found out a few months later that he had a he had an improper relationship with a former girlfriend has former company Michaels and gave her some Deals. They got rid of him. The chair of the time. Who had been on the board and was part of the committee to hire? As she became became the interim CEO, his name is Michael Bender. Okay, so that's where we are. So who do you blame for this headline? Do you blame as she can and he's the CEO? Who had the improper relationship who know got the okay. Do you blame investors? This is the other part of the story that was it was so crazy the time, two weeks after this happened. Investors actually had a chance to vote at the meeting two weeks after she became step down, instead of getting angry everybody. They voted 92% average, yes, on the entire board. including Bender, Who was the chair at the time and including A Precinct, Jonas Precinct, who was the compensation committee chair, who was actually in charge of succession planning or hired actually began, everybody. They just supported everything and despite that they barely passed pay. So there were angry at pay right? 55% said yes who I remember this because We were like, who's pay. Are they angry at the guy who just Got named. CEO, I guess they were upset at the guy who was already fired, who got a big golden, hello? Because the next pay package for the chair, for the, for Michael Bender was the same as the whole thing is so confusing. So do you blame it? Investors for just being a confusing mess and refusing to protest. This horrible embarrassing selection for of Ashley became a blend. The compensation committee already mentioned them. No, Not only was chair. Jonas Precinct. There. He's been on the board for a decade and remember the competition company was responsible for succession planning but the same Michael Bender. Who was sheriff is now CEO was also on that committee responsible for succession planning. I hate all this. I hate everything. Do you blame Michael Bender himself for being the new the new CEO? Do you blame the current CEO for being the new CEO? Because again, he was the chair. He was on the comp committee. He's getting the same. He's actually getting the same pay package as the one that they just voted against. He's actually getting slightly more and Jet perks. Slightly more, I can't relocation. He's getting a smaller golden. Hello only four million dollars, basically. It's the same PayPal package that investors voted no one or finally breathlessly. Do you blame the concept, the of the glass Cliff where women and people of color who are promoted to precariously leadership positions during times of Crisis or organizational turmoil or poor performance. Now, Kohl's has all of those things and Michael Bender is a black man. Very few black men. See the black Cliff? Yeah, right. So that no, but it's still it's still a glass clip its women and people. Color both. So, do you blame the car? So we missed reading this. Is it really not Michael, Bender's fault. Is he just there? Because he's gonna be a placeholder until the next one? Because coal is a disaster. It's it's, it's it's a mess. Oh, that last one. Just threw me for a loop because the easy answer here is amazing, correct like that? Yes, answer is Michael Bender is not actually be Canon. He screwed up to succession the first time. Yes, it's like he's screwed it up. Like, in fact, in fact, what we I think what we dug up is that we they actually Michaels he did the same thing at Michaels. There were already reports of as she became and screwing up before. But this isn't just Kohl's problem too. We just we literally just in the scene. They who was it? That hired Lloyd's. Yeah that was egg. Egg just hired a like the second and Commercial you always yeah. Who everywhere he went there were reports of the same thing. They hired him anyway and then a report comes out and they're like oh you're fired right? Like does back up our one of our main theories of the world that we cover is that it is it is a protected class. It is like a private network of people into your point. The only thing you can do to screw it up is to to miss a few meetings otherwise if you're in it you're in it and they don't care what you've done wrong they're not going to really look at they're not gonna look unless you're a woman or a person of color or not. Going to do a lot of digging to see if you're qualified. They're just going to ask you to join right? But that last one like Michael Bender was the easy answer here because he's bored chair, he picked. But he like that. Yeah, Canon then then he's running, he was Running the board. He was named the interim CEO and he's running the board already and then the rest of the board is just like, you're doing a great job. Why don't you just keep doing it? And like the same place, the same pay package and he has no retail CEO experience. Now as she became and came in with that pay package, at least he had come from Michaels in the retail world, as he go. Yeah, this guy, the former chair who screwed up sexually, he's getting the same PayPal package. Somehow. I don't know how that's happening but and yet you are 100% correct. That the minute he fails a minute. There's a yeah right? He's gone. There's no way he sticks around. What a name? Yeah. What do you think here? Oh, I don't like this one at all. You don't blame Concepts but this is interesting. I might blame the concept, it's these. That because now if he gets fired you don't know if he got fired because he's a black man who had no leash or he underperformed or You, you don't know anymore. You don't know if he got hired. Because he is best for the job or because they needed somebody to do the job of cleanup while they found someone else. You don't know? Yes, here's what I actually honestly think is because we, you know, having covering holes as we have all year long. It is been struggling, all year round. I think they've come to a point where they're like not turning around. We don't know what it can't get any worse. Let's just keep the glass clipart to your point. We can bail on him in like, 14 months, when we need to. But we're, you know, I don't like this. I don't like it at all because that's what I'm going with. All right, let's end the show with more. This one's light. Light as, in not serious because I read this article. I don't know why I read this article. Oh, yeah. Because I, I stupidly tagged these because you tagged it, they make me angry and I read it. Okay. I'm the chief people officer at Walmart. I always wake up to the same U2 song and watch The Today Show. That's the headline, is this, you watch the same Today Show or like the next the days. Oh, it's the day that is today. Thank you song. It's the new. This is Donna Morris, Chief people officer at Walmart. She's listening to Beautiful Day by YouTube every single one, because there's a lot of Bleak stuff in the YouTube channel. Like you used to be a very political band back in the day. I mean like, like, you know, Bloody Sunday Bloody Sunday, Bloody Sunday like he could have been that song. It was it. No, beautiful day. The first thing she does. Every morning is go online. She doesn't Drink coffee. But she does drink diet coke. She says, quote, this is this is what I read today. This is like, well, I love this. Actually, I've just never been a hot drink type of girl, I guess. Well, I tried Coke in the microwave. I mean, what are you doing? And she's not a hot dog, girl. I try to limit myself to two Diet Cokes a day. Although, every once in a while, I sneak in a third. Yeah, you should not do any of that. Drink the black coffee or iced coffee is healthier. Like, I read like long, things about Zuckerberg and his genius, and he's evilness, and I'm reading about her, Diet, Coke, drinking habits, what we're doing a woman and she's like, a woman of color, by the way. No, she's not. She's a white woman. All right. Um, this is in the article. She likes buying cookbooks but she said she's a horrible cook and just Cooks the same thing every time. How she? I guess? There's paperweights. I don't know. I mean you have access to all the like cooking stuff all that like appliances at Walmart like all the food cook. Books, you can't learn how to cook and nowhere in the article, does it mention of the cheap people officer Walmart's Dei rollback, the new CEO. They have a new CEO. Yeah. John mentioned. The fact that Doug McMillan's just stepped down nothing. She just mentioned The Waltons working for the family a family dictatorship. She doesn't mention any other colleagues except entirely in the abstract you're the child officer. The only thing the only place where she mentions twice that she meets with Associates but she the only thing times she like mentions people is she stays past 6:00 every night because there's fewer people in the office. Oh, wait a minute, the chief people officer doesn't even want the people. Yeah, introvert. Yeah, and I was gonna say she probably only meets with the associates because she's on her way to get a Diet Coke. So she has to pass them in the aisles. Yes, she's got, like, talk to them while she's pulling it out of the refrigerator. What do we blame for this existing? Like this, this whole article all of this. Okay. Do we blame professional? Conservative snowflake Robbie Starbucks? Yeah. He's a currently a consultant at meta. Yes, of course he is. He claimed Walmart as his first Victory. Okay, I forgot this. All right. Okay, but this is, this is post. I actually think that like post Starbucks, Robbie Starbucks snowflake ISM Morris. Might have actually had a job managing people, right? But now isn't her job to just make sure there's like less swastikas on the bathroom wall. Like, like now she's got nothing but time. So she's giving interviews to Business Insider about like her diet, coke drinking habits. Most of the Coast Guard just demoted swastikas and nooses. That they're not hate symbols anymore, so maybe she doesn't have to worry about so now she's not worrying. So now if you're not worrying, what are you doing with your time now? Businesses inside our calls and she's like, yeah, sure. I've got like an hour to give you to discuss. What time I wake up in the morning. I gotta tell you, I'm I'm one thing. I am impressed with those if businesses that are called me. And I don't know what they're waiting for. I'd give it an interview about my day. I would, I would probably I see. I'm So Vain, or maybe worried about what people think. I probably would hide my diet coke addiction. I I talked about all the good positive things I do, I would maybe I wouldn't say that I was drinking like Coke or something like, you know? I mean, Think it's just it's incredibly proud of her proud of how much people want to talk about just themselves like is really shocking. Do you blame? That's number one. Do you blame number two Business Insider? Well yeah, they publish the article, I do tag a lot of stories from them though. Yeah they must have known Morris had the potential to give one of the most insipid article reviews of her day. Yes, but the headlines great, though, let's be fair. No, you because you, when you read her, excuse for Walmart's Dei rollback, you must know that she has nothing interesting to say after this, right? She said, quote, when you talk about diversity equity and inclusion, all in part, there can be communities and often the largest communities that step back and say geez I'm not sure if I'm even actually included. That's what she described. That's really that was her explanation for why Walmart was rolling back Dei. So her perspective, was what? Like a white Christian or something. That was the Starbucks. I don't white person wasn't included. Is that I guess? Yes, the largest like the white male Evangelical Christians. I don't like, I don't know. What is the Walmart? That's okay. What Robbie Starbucks actually said, was quote. This is the biggest win yet for our movement to end wokeness in Corporate America. This won't just have a massive effect for their employees who will have a neutral workplace. So start by saying the same thing you truly workplace. So okay, so now we're saying that. When You Subtract women and people of color from America's Got created a neutral. Well, it's like when you go to the paint store and you've got to get neutral colors right? Like, Egypt, they're mostly like white in cream. Right there. There's not a lot of like weird way to describe this, a neutral workplace. So do you blame Business Insider who put probably knew she was going to say in things that I'm gonna thank business inside. I go ahead. Do you blame Donna? Morris herself? Okay. because as we covered here on this show, yeah, she said this in another headline, we did. Okay, I remember tagged. Yeah, this was, this was an article by. I think it was CNBC, or MSNBC. NBC, it was CNBC like take it now, I didn't link the article, but she said that she was talking about the biggest red flag that she sees as the chief people officer at Walmart. It is an employee. This is what she said. Quote, nobody wants to hire a Debbie Downer, oh, a shrill woman, you mean someone, who is constantly negative, you know, they're gonna show up and they're going to bring the problem, never the solution. Oh literally, the job of HR and the chief people officer. Is to feel complaints from employees, or from Starbucks, or from Robbie Starbucks. Like is it two Debbie Downer when an employee mentions racial discrimination and then the EEOC has to sue Walmart for it. Maybe they were just Debbie, Downer bad look. By the way, you had it. You had a gender, your negative person. You had to gender. Like you, you couldn't be more creative to pick a Just like a an employee. Who's negative? You had to make it a woman. Like that was your what? I've been a little weak though. Don't you think like, what are we doing here? So, Donna Morris. Maybe we blame Donna Morris. Because like, like she's the one who like, she's like, a beautiful day and telling people, like, stop being such a Debbie Downer like, yeah, I'm getting. Why should I listen to beautiful day ever? She must have very negative dreams and thoughts. Yeah. Maybe she's covering up or do we blame Walmart's board because someone somewhere must have sign off on Morris getting higher. Right? She got hired I think in 2020 one. And as a new Chief people officer, do you blame a Walton? Do you blame the board? Someone thought this was a good idea and take a look, you could take your pick of the board members because on the board is a series of luminaries who, like, maybe they all, don't like Debbie downers. And they all drink, diet coke twice a day, the CFO of open. AI, Sarah fire on the board. Oh, we covered in Partnership, new partnership. Yes, I have a new partnership with them. So, very strategic, you know, personal having the board, she all. So mentioned that open, AI could use a government backstop. And then clarified, that you remember that we covered that here, Brian Nichol. CEO Starbucks. Yeah, he was just actually, I just had to start by him being a bad CEO. Yeah. Um, he I just, I say, I put it here. He was just named to a worst CEO list. Oh, so good for him after getting a golden. Hello? A golden parachute. Golden shower. I don't know all the golden million dollars. He got so much money to not be good. Starbucks is still suffering? Yeah. Walmart has the current and former CEO of Walmart on this board, right? Like still like Doug McMillan on the board still there Donna Morris, right, until he actually leaves. You're right. He's still there and the new CEO. Yes. John furner furnace for furner. Yeah. For not Turner. That's, that's his like, brother and her John furner. The new CEO. He has been there for 20 years or 30 years, you know, since like, 93 93 forever. So he could very well have hired her or at least know her. Do you blame Stuart Walton? Oh, Who couldn't even bother be called Stewart like Stuart. Yeah, he put an e in his name. It's s t. E u a r t so you're blaming him for his own. Come on. It's so fucking pretentious. Yeah. Are you blaming him though? For that naming right? Not his parents. Yeah, I'm blaming him for like not changing it as a chance. His only thing he has done so far to get on this board, was being a Walton because in his Wikipedia page, it says he's married to a Baywatch reboot actress and that's basically like that's all he's done. Okay. Greg Penner also on the board son-in-law of the Walt's and son-in-law co-owner of the Denver Broncos everything through the Walton family just exactly. Yeah nothing there and then there's the like the rest of the board that includes Tom Horton. Who was America Airlines? CEO and CFO right before they declared bankruptcy. Oh. Jesus Marissa Mayer, that was a mayor. Oh, yeah, there are two separate Consultants on here. One from pricewaterhousecoopers, one from, right, you gotta have. Yeah, there is Randall Stevens in the X 18 T CEO, who, if I'm honest. I actually everything I read about that guy. I like that guy. I like he seems like a good people. I love him. Yeah, yeah, go ahead and lump him in with the two other Dei directors. There's one from NBC Universal and there's a woman like, who are just they they're the only people of color on the board. So they clearly their marginalized, right? So, well, this is really important, does it really matter because the family control the board is just kind of like their play their friends, their playthings right things. Yeah, their plaything. So those are your options. Your options are, who do we blame for this incident article, Robbie Starbucks business inside our Donna Morris or Walmart's board. I was gonna go Donna Morris, but then I cheated and I noticed that she is Canadian. So, I'm gonna give her a pass, you know, because I having lived in Canada for two years. It is my absolutely conviction. That Canadians just nicer. I think she just might be nice, so I'm not gonna blame her not gonna blame Donna Morris. I should blame the Walton family. I also should blame businesses that are for their amazing amount of clickbait. Although I love the, I love the headline wakes up to the same song and watches the show. I mean it's just so stupid. I'm gonna actually go for Robbie Starbucks. Wow Starbucks but here's my theory here. Is that this Maga anti Dei error that we're living in, has created a corporate world where it is, okay? For the chief people officer of Walmart, which might be one of the biggest Employers in the world. If I mean, the United States. I mean it's very important company over a million that it's okay for her to do stories about drinking diet coke and watching TV, where she should be talking about the the labor force. I want to hear about labor at Walmart. That's all I want to hear about. Because it's a really good. Because if you treat, if you treat that labor force, well if you pay them a living wage, if you give them top benefits, if you all of that, that automatically becomes a model for the rest of the United States. So I want to hear about that from Donna Morris every time she talks. I want to hear about that. And then maybe every 20th article she can talk about Diet Coke. So I blame Robbie for getting us back to the point where we can't even talk about. Like, important issues. You know what, we have to talk about insipidus. I read a lot about Donna Morris today like more than any other person you should read about Donald Morris. And I came away feeling like she was basically nothing, like it was a whole bunch of nothing burger. And I like, and I wanted to not like her, but it might be totally right? She cannot say anything anymore. She was in an America. That's stopped being able to talk. Yeah. And we wouldn't want to, we don't want to to Robbie's point the the The people, the work it should be neutral right workers should be a neutral. Play feel. They shouldn't represent anything right? They shouldn't represent rights. They shouldn't represent anything political nothing. It's just be a bunch of faceless neutral nothings. Yeah I think you might be right. That was exhausting. You know, I'm just always exhausting. I can't blame us for this one because we're taking. We're skipping the rest of the week, because of things giving. So this will be our holiday. There's no more shows this week. That's all we got twice listened to it twice. Give, thanks for something. If you're in the US, if you're not in the US, laugh at the US, that's hazelnut Rallis. I'm your analysis at mascardi. We are free float. Come back next week when we reboot with all new shows and all new stuff and like all new data. I've got so many cool findings from this predictor thing that I want to roll out. So we'll talk more about that until then good.